Theosophic Misfits

Ok, this isn't a debate, per se... but it is a question...

What precisely is meant by an earth-based or earth-centered religion/spirituality?

The reason I ask is because I was reading about this one tradition which has high days marked by the solar events, seasonal cycles, and the moon phases (full and new) - and yet they claim that they are not earth-based because they revere the divine in ALL THINGS, and not just the Earth and earth-based creatures...

Their definition of earth-based seems to focus solely on those who honor the whole Gaia-force...

But, to me, if your celebrations and beliefs revolve around nature... the nature that we are experiencing on earth... then how is this not earth-based?  
_________________
"... he who dares not grasp the thorn... should not crave the rose..."

To be nobody but yourself in a world which is doing its best night and day to make you like everybody else means to fight the hardest battle any human being can fight and never stop fighting. --e. e. cummings

[blackrose]

Ok, this isn't a debate, per se... but it is a question...

What precisely is meant by an earth-based or earth-centered religion/spirituality?

The reason I ask is because I was reading about this one tradition which has high days marked by the solar events, seasonal cycles, and the moon phases (full and new) - and yet they claim that they are not earth-based because they revere the divine in ALL THINGS, and not just the Earth and earth-based creatures...

Their definition of earth-based seems to focus solely on those who honor the whole Gaia-force...

But, to me, if your celebrations and beliefs revolve around nature... the nature that we are experiencing on earth... then how is this not earth-based?  
_________________
"... he who dares not grasp the thorn... should not crave the rose..."

To be nobody but yourself in a world which is doing its best night and day to make you like everybody else means to fight the hardest battle any human being can fight and never stop fighting. --e. e. cummings

Ok, this isn't a debate, per se... but it is a question...

What precisely is meant by an earth-based or earth-centered religion/spirituality?

The reason I ask is because I was reading about this one tradition which has high days marked by the solar events, seasonal cycles, and the moon phases (full and new) - and yet they claim that they are not earth-based because they revere the divine in ALL THINGS, and not just the Earth and earth-based creatures...

Their definition of earth-based seems to focus solely on those who honor the whole Gaia-force...

But, to me, if your celebrations and beliefs revolve around nature... the nature that we are experiencing on earth... then how is this not earth-based?  
_________________
"... he who dares not grasp the thorn... should not crave the rose..."

To be nobody but yourself in a world which is doing its best night and day to make you like everybody else means to fight the hardest battle any human being can fight and never stop fighting. --e. e. cummings

[blackrose]

Ok, this isn't a debate, per se... but it is a question...

What precisely is meant by an earth-based or earth-centered religion/spirituality?

The reason I ask is because I was reading about this one tradition which has high days marked by the solar events, seasonal cycles, and the moon phases (full and new) - and yet they claim that they are not earth-based because they revere the divine in ALL THINGS, and not just the Earth and earth-based creatures...

Their definition of earth-based seems to focus solely on those who honor the whole Gaia-force...

But, to me, if your celebrations and beliefs revolve around nature... the nature that we are experiencing on earth... then how is this not earth-based?  
_________________
"... he who dares not grasp the thorn... should not crave the rose..."

To be nobody but yourself in a world which is doing its best night and day to make you like everybody else means to fight the hardest battle any human being can fight and never stop fighting. --e. e. cummings

I usually read "Earth-based" as encompassing the nature and natural forces of our planet... both as a physical object or system as well as a spiritual force or entity.  I do not think the applications of this term are necessarily confined simply to the element of Stone (or Earth in most common elemental systems), but rather to the unifying and gestalten essence of the world... up to and including even celestial forces and symbols (insofar as they intersect with the motions of the natural essence).

It seems weird that this tradition would observe all the earmarks of an Earth-based tradition and then reject the title due to their belief that the divine is implicit in all things... I view these two as naturally related, at least in most cases.  Maybe it is just a case of trying to stand out for its own sake... or trying to make a name for themselves by running contrary to the crowd.  Who can say?

- Darkk
_________________
All around me darkness gathers,
Fading is the sun that shone,
We must speak of other matters,
You can be me when I'm gone.

[Darkk]

I usually read "Earth-based" as encompassing the nature and natural forces of our planet... both as a physical object or system as well as a spiritual force or entity.  I do not think the applications of this term are necessarily confined simply to the element of Stone (or Earth in most common elemental systems), but rather to the unifying and gestalten essence of the world... up to and including even celestial forces and symbols (insofar as they intersect with the motions of the natural essence).

It seems weird that this tradition would observe all the earmarks of an Earth-based tradition and then reject the title due to their belief that the divine is implicit in all things... I view these two as naturally related, at least in most cases.  Maybe it is just a case of trying to stand out for its own sake... or trying to make a name for themselves by running contrary to the crowd.  Who can say?

- Darkk
_________________
All around me darkness gathers,
Fading is the sun that shone,
We must speak of other matters,
You can be me when I'm gone.

I usually read "Earth-based" as encompassing the nature and natural forces of our planet... both as a physical object or system as well as a spiritual force or entity.  I do not think the applications of this term are necessarily confined simply to the element of Stone (or Earth in most common elemental systems), but rather to the unifying and gestalten essence of the world... up to and including even celestial forces and symbols (insofar as they intersect with the motions of the natural essence).

It seems weird that this tradition would observe all the earmarks of an Earth-based tradition and then reject the title due to their belief that the divine is implicit in all things... I view these two as naturally related, at least in most cases.  Maybe it is just a case of trying to stand out for its own sake... or trying to make a name for themselves by running contrary to the crowd.  Who can say?

- Darkk
_________________
All around me darkness gathers,
Fading is the sun that shone,
We must speak of other matters,
You can be me when I'm gone.

[Darkk]

I usually read "Earth-based" as encompassing the nature and natural forces of our planet... both as a physical object or system as well as a spiritual force or entity.  I do not think the applications of this term are necessarily confined simply to the element of Stone (or Earth in most common elemental systems), but rather to the unifying and gestalten essence of the world... up to and including even celestial forces and symbols (insofar as they intersect with the motions of the natural essence).

It seems weird that this tradition would observe all the earmarks of an Earth-based tradition and then reject the title due to their belief that the divine is implicit in all things... I view these two as naturally related, at least in most cases.  Maybe it is just a case of trying to stand out for its own sake... or trying to make a name for themselves by running contrary to the crowd.  Who can say?

- Darkk
_________________
All around me darkness gathers,
Fading is the sun that shone,
We must speak of other matters,
You can be me when I'm gone.

[blackrose]

[blackrose]

[Impqueen]

[quote="Impqueen"]I also agree    might have trouble getting a juicy debate going here...   [/question]

Well, I did say it was more a question than a debate double

[blackrose]

[quote="Impqueen"]I also agree    might have trouble getting a juicy debate going here...   [/question]

Well, I did say it was more a question than a debate double

[quote="Impqueen"]I also agree    might have trouble getting a juicy debate going here...   [/question]

Well, I did say it was more a question than a debate double

[blackrose]

[quote="Impqueen"]I also agree    might have trouble getting a juicy debate going here...   [/question]

Well, I did say it was more a question than a debate double

[Darkk]

[Darkk]

Would a mechanistic approach potentially base their high holy days around things like the moon phases and solar events... perhaps tapping into the mechanistics behind them as opposed to their more natural auspices?

On one hand I do see what you're saying and where the differentiation lies... on the other hand, to me, to work with the physical force of nature is also to work with the more metaphysical/abstract essences of it, as well... Tho perhaps I tend to blend naturalistic and mechanistic auspices?  

I do think that, overall, tho... I am more naturally, well, naturalistic...
_________________
"... he who dares not grasp the thorn... should not crave the rose..."

To be nobody but yourself in a world which is doing its best night and day to make you like everybody else means to fight the hardest battle any human being can fight and never stop fighting. --e. e. cummings

[blackrose]

Would a mechanistic approach potentially base their high holy days around things like the moon phases and solar events... perhaps tapping into the mechanistics behind them as opposed to their more natural auspices?

On one hand I do see what you're saying and where the differentiation lies... on the other hand, to me, to work with the physical force of nature is also to work with the more metaphysical/abstract essences of it, as well... Tho perhaps I tend to blend naturalistic and mechanistic auspices?  

I do think that, overall, tho... I am more naturally, well, naturalistic...
_________________
"... he who dares not grasp the thorn... should not crave the rose..."

To be nobody but yourself in a world which is doing its best night and day to make you like everybody else means to fight the hardest battle any human being can fight and never stop fighting. --e. e. cummings

Would a mechanistic approach potentially base their high holy days around things like the moon phases and solar events... perhaps tapping into the mechanistics behind them as opposed to their more natural auspices?

On one hand I do see what you're saying and where the differentiation lies... on the other hand, to me, to work with the physical force of nature is also to work with the more metaphysical/abstract essences of it, as well... Tho perhaps I tend to blend naturalistic and mechanistic auspices?  

I do think that, overall, tho... I am more naturally, well, naturalistic...
_________________
"... he who dares not grasp the thorn... should not crave the rose..."

To be nobody but yourself in a world which is doing its best night and day to make you like everybody else means to fight the hardest battle any human being can fight and never stop fighting. --e. e. cummings

[blackrose]

Would a mechanistic approach potentially base their high holy days around things like the moon phases and solar events... perhaps tapping into the mechanistics behind them as opposed to their more natural auspices?

On one hand I do see what you're saying and where the differentiation lies... on the other hand, to me, to work with the physical force of nature is also to work with the more metaphysical/abstract essences of it, as well... Tho perhaps I tend to blend naturalistic and mechanistic auspices?  

I do think that, overall, tho... I am more naturally, well, naturalistic...
_________________
"... he who dares not grasp the thorn... should not crave the rose..."

To be nobody but yourself in a world which is doing its best night and day to make you like everybody else means to fight the hardest battle any human being can fight and never stop fighting. --e. e. cummings

I would say they could, but it's uncommon... it would be like my own tradition where lunar and/or solar occurrences are actually holdovers from older or integrated traditions that once celebrated them (Iver Toth, the Beast Moon, the Sorcerer's Moon, etc.)  I would also say that there is a healthy amount of overlap between the two, depending on the practitioner in question... mechanistic vs. naturalistic are really approaches to the essence, ways of viewing or working with them... in some contexts, one always seems to offer an advantage over the other.

I would definitely agree you lean more towards naturalistic approaches... this is more in line with your personality and worldview.  I think the key is in understanding that both approaches have their merits and flaws, and that in the overall sense they are balanced between one-another pretty evenly.

- Darkk
_________________
All around me darkness gathers,
Fading is the sun that shone,
We must speak of other matters,
You can be me when I'm gone.

[Darkk]

I would say they could, but it's uncommon... it would be like my own tradition where lunar and/or solar occurrences are actually holdovers from older or integrated traditions that once celebrated them (Iver Toth, the Beast Moon, the Sorcerer's Moon, etc.)  I would also say that there is a healthy amount of overlap between the two, depending on the practitioner in question... mechanistic vs. naturalistic are really approaches to the essence, ways of viewing or working with them... in some contexts, one always seems to offer an advantage over the other.

I would definitely agree you lean more towards naturalistic approaches... this is more in line with your personality and worldview.  I think the key is in understanding that both approaches have their merits and flaws, and that in the overall sense they are balanced between one-another pretty evenly.

- Darkk
_________________
All around me darkness gathers,
Fading is the sun that shone,
We must speak of other matters,
You can be me when I'm gone.

I would say they could, but it's uncommon... it would be like my own tradition where lunar and/or solar occurrences are actually holdovers from older or integrated traditions that once celebrated them (Iver Toth, the Beast Moon, the Sorcerer's Moon, etc.)  I would also say that there is a healthy amount of overlap between the two, depending on the practitioner in question... mechanistic vs. naturalistic are really approaches to the essence, ways of viewing or working with them... in some contexts, one always seems to offer an advantage over the other.

I would definitely agree you lean more towards naturalistic approaches... this is more in line with your personality and worldview.  I think the key is in understanding that both approaches have their merits and flaws, and that in the overall sense they are balanced between one-another pretty evenly.

- Darkk
_________________
All around me darkness gathers,
Fading is the sun that shone,
We must speak of other matters,
You can be me when I'm gone.

[Darkk]

I would say they could, but it's uncommon... it would be like my own tradition where lunar and/or solar occurrences are actually holdovers from older or integrated traditions that once celebrated them (Iver Toth, the Beast Moon, the Sorcerer's Moon, etc.)  I would also say that there is a healthy amount of overlap between the two, depending on the practitioner in question... mechanistic vs. naturalistic are really approaches to the essence, ways of viewing or working with them... in some contexts, one always seems to offer an advantage over the other.

I would definitely agree you lean more towards naturalistic approaches... this is more in line with your personality and worldview.  I think the key is in understanding that both approaches have their merits and flaws, and that in the overall sense they are balanced between one-another pretty evenly.

- Darkk
_________________
All around me darkness gathers,
Fading is the sun that shone,
We must speak of other matters,
You can be me when I'm gone.

I think what bothers me most about the mechanistic approach isn't the approach itself but rather a sort of fallacy which seems to sometimes grow out of it...

Those people who seem to think that the power, etc, lies solely within them and their perspectives... who see the essences not as natural phenom, as I do... but as more metaphorical symbolisms...

I don't think is an ipso facto downfall of the mechanistic approach... as you are rather mechanistic, but still have respect for the essences themselves, as external realities...

Of course, the naturalistic approach is not without its downfalls, as well... for exmaple, perhaps, the over personification of the energies to the degree of giving up your own sense of will and identity when dealing with them...
_________________
"... he who dares not grasp the thorn... should not crave the rose..."

To be nobody but yourself in a world which is doing its best night and day to make you like everybody else means to fight the hardest battle any human being can fight and never stop fighting. --e. e. cummings

[blackrose]

I think what bothers me most about the mechanistic approach isn't the approach itself but rather a sort of fallacy which seems to sometimes grow out of it...

Those people who seem to think that the power, etc, lies solely within them and their perspectives... who see the essences not as natural phenom, as I do... but as more metaphorical symbolisms...

I don't think is an ipso facto downfall of the mechanistic approach... as you are rather mechanistic, but still have respect for the essences themselves, as external realities...

Of course, the naturalistic approach is not without its downfalls, as well... for exmaple, perhaps, the over personification of the energies to the degree of giving up your own sense of will and identity when dealing with them...
_________________
"... he who dares not grasp the thorn... should not crave the rose..."

To be nobody but yourself in a world which is doing its best night and day to make you like everybody else means to fight the hardest battle any human being can fight and never stop fighting. --e. e. cummings

I think what bothers me most about the mechanistic approach isn't the approach itself but rather a sort of fallacy which seems to sometimes grow out of it...

Those people who seem to think that the power, etc, lies solely within them and their perspectives... who see the essences not as natural phenom, as I do... but as more metaphorical symbolisms...

I don't think is an ipso facto downfall of the mechanistic approach... as you are rather mechanistic, but still have respect for the essences themselves, as external realities...

Of course, the naturalistic approach is not without its downfalls, as well... for exmaple, perhaps, the over personification of the energies to the degree of giving up your own sense of will and identity when dealing with them...
_________________
"... he who dares not grasp the thorn... should not crave the rose..."

To be nobody but yourself in a world which is doing its best night and day to make you like everybody else means to fight the hardest battle any human being can fight and never stop fighting. --e. e. cummings

[blackrose]

I think what bothers me most about the mechanistic approach isn't the approach itself but rather a sort of fallacy which seems to sometimes grow out of it...

Those people who seem to think that the power, etc, lies solely within them and their perspectives... who see the essences not as natural phenom, as I do... but as more metaphorical symbolisms...

I don't think is an ipso facto downfall of the mechanistic approach... as you are rather mechanistic, but still have respect for the essences themselves, as external realities...

Of course, the naturalistic approach is not without its downfalls, as well... for exmaple, perhaps, the over personification of the energies to the degree of giving up your own sense of will and identity when dealing with them...
_________________
"... he who dares not grasp the thorn... should not crave the rose..."

To be nobody but yourself in a world which is doing its best night and day to make you like everybody else means to fight the hardest battle any human being can fight and never stop fighting. --e. e. cummings